Cobra Mist

[Frank]

Hi Larry,

Well, I advised Ian earlier not to ignore key witnesses. I think I will follow my own advice on this one, which means following yours .. I’m going to wait and see what Jim and John come up with and leave the third night alone.

In the meantime, I will try to obtain a copy of Andrew Pike’s book. Andrew, if you are reading this and can be of any help please post me a PM – it seems your book is no longer available anywhere.

You know, It took scientists many decades to accept the reality of meteors. The idea of rocks falling from the sky simply did not appeal to them. Their model of the Universe did not allow for rocks to exist in the vastness of space. All this time witnesses to a meteor were pretty much treated like the UFO witnesses today. The “debunkers” of that period were determined to educate the public and to explain them that rocks could not come from the sky. Every sighting of a meteor was explained away as misinterpretation, hoax, etc.

I think we are going through the same motions concerning UFO’s. The idea of intelligently controlled objects visiting Earth from time to time simply does not appeal to science. Their current model of the Universe does not allow for other intelligences that bridge the enormous distances in space and time. Reliable witnesses are treated like fools with too much imagination. The “debunkers” of our period are determined to educate the public and to explain them that other intelligences cannot come to Earth, and if they could they would behave differently. Every sighting of a UFO is explained away as misinterpretation, hoax, etc.

Acceptance of disturbing, non-appealing ideas by science is a very slow process. The thought that we are visited occasionally by an intelligence that does not event attempt to get in touch is indeed disturbing and pulls many people right out of their comfort zone.

But maybe in the next decade or so, science will finally accept the reality of intelligently controlled objects visiting our planet. When that happens the RFI will probably be regarded in retrospect as one of the most important cases that helped to tip the balance, and you will be remembered as the guy who brought it into the public domain.

Cheers to that!
Frank

( And maybe after a further ten years, Ian will finally be convinced .. )

[larry warren]

hello again Frank,
i agree with all of your views on this matter, i dont class ian as a debunker though, more of
an educated guy that perhaps that cant conceive of this ufo stuff having a reaility to it ?
Debunkers are a nasty bunch, like to pick on woman aswell ! cant catchem though caus they
hide real good !The ufo researchers are a much bigger problem because many of them love theselves more than the cause! and tend to use wittinesses then discard them when its time
for a new CASE.
Also they have no problem with rearanging the facts of a wittinesses account if it dosent fit
the PROJECT they are working on! thus leaving the wittiness forevermore defending him/herself!
Seen it all for years mate.and Any high profile wittiness to any case will back me up on that.
the book is still availible on amazon, also can be ordered in any uk bookseller.
the update in 2005, cosimo press ny, is the one i recomend as the origional publisher are thieves!
at present the book is number 70 with WH SMITH, perhaps due to the recent CBS radio show
3 million people listened in! not bad eh! and not bad for a 13 yo book, If read youd find most
of the questions about me ANSWERED and self EVIDENT.!
Cheers frank and good luck
Larry
Ps Linda Howe Please Answer my email, send along report 11,and attach my response to it!
thanks doll!
Thanks Frank for lettin me chuck that one in!

[larry warren]

Frank, sorry mate, my eyesight is crap, You cant find Andrews book!
well he is a very nice openminded smart guy! sorry about the shamless self promotion!
And never again will i say that you can get our book on AMAZON or COSIMO PRESS
for 16.99 { and some old hardbacks for less!} BARGAN!
Never again, Really.
Cheers
LAZ

[Andrew Pike]

Hello Frank

I received your PM.

My book has just about run its couse now. Unless a new publisher is interested in a re-release, which seems doubtful thanks to the current mess the banks and politicians have got us into with the economy. Who should I vote for on Thursday? None of the above!!

It was published for the 25th anniversary five years ago, March 2005, not 2006 as Amazon say! So at least that is one date confusion corrected in this case!!

It only saw the light of day because several ufologists asked me to produce something about what I did on the subject. There are no plans to do anything more, I effectively retired from ufology in 2006 and since then I've only been to two conferences and appeared once on TV with Ray Bowyer (the pilot who saw UFOs over the Channel Islands), and that was done because we were helping media students at a college I once worked at get some experience in real TV. Plus the producers would only do it if a qualified astrophysicist was involved! Enter you know who stage right! Larry and Nick Pope were also involved.

By the way did Larry mention he has also written a book on the case!!!

You're right about science, it's groaning at the seams with stories of mindset scientists who said something was impossible only to find it became a reality. I have several books on my shelf about that area of history.

Andrew

[Frank]

Thanks for your reply, Andrew. Hopefully I can get a copy on the used market then.

I do know Larry's book, though I must admit I did not read it yet.
(And to make things worse - I did read Bruni's book ..)
Luckily it is still available so it's not too late to improve my life ...

What I like about Andrew's book is that it discusses the physics behind it all. I only know of one other book on the physics behind UFO sightings, which is Paul Hill's "Unconventional Flying Objects - a scientific analysis".

Talking about science, Stephen Hawking recently warned us not to talk to aliens
(http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/space/article7107207.ece)

Interesting is the end of this article:

Similarly, Lord Rees, the astronomer royal, warned in a lecture earlier this year that aliens might prove to be beyond human understanding.

“I suspect there could be life and intelligence out there in forms we can’t conceive,” he said. “Just as a chimpanzee can’t understand quantum theory, it could be there are aspects of reality that are beyond the capacity of our brains.”

Almost sounds as if he was a witness to the RFI ...

[Andrew Pike]

I do know Larry's book, though I must admit I did not read it yet.

What I like about Andrew's book is that it discusses the physics behind it all. I only know of one other book on the physics behind UFO sightings, which is Paul Hill's "Unconventional Flying Objects - a scientific analysis".

You should read Larry's book, I found it very useful when trying to get to grips with this case.

Science and UFOs! Not an easy mix, for several reasons. Much of what I have read/encountered has not been published, probably be a long time before it is, if ever! Certainly I have made it a 30 year rule, from day one in the subject, never to talk to fellow astronomers about UFOs unless they were on the same team as myself investigating the subject. Others in science share the same view.

Andrew

[Frank]

You should read Larry's book, I found it very useful when trying to get to grips with this case.

Thanks, Andrew, I ordered Larry's book a few days ago. Hopefully it arrives this week.

You're right, UFO's and science is not an easy mix. Earlier I made a comparison between UFO's and meteors, but meteors really were a "piece of cake" compared to UFO's and everything that surrounds them (considering this, it would make sense for the "ones-who-know" to keep it secret and it would also make sense for possible extraterrestials not to interfere with our immature and unstable society.)

Maybe you know this astronomer, who has his own website dedicated to the UFO phenomenon:
http://www.ufoskeptic.org/

[Andrew Pike]

Maybe you know this astronomer, who has his own website dedicated to the UFO phenomenon:
http://www.ufoskeptic.org/

I don't know him personally but I am aware of his work and his website, I haven't had direct dealings with either when it comes to my research with UFOs. As I say, I have a strict rule not to bring any astronomers into what I do unless they are directly on a team with me, believe me it is far, far better that way!!!

There are several levels of UFO research when it comes to astronomers and the 'politics' of this is interesting in itself. As I have said many times over the years there are astronomers seriously investigating UFOs but it is not an easy area of the subject to understand or really get to know exactly who is doing what and where or why!

Having said that, it is one of the better, openminded, sites considering it is astronomy based, although I feel the title of the site gives the wrong impression and there may be a bit of hidden psychology from the old days still there.

Andrew

[stephan]

According to John Burroughs, Jim Penniston thought JB was armed. JB said he did not carry a weapon. As they were getting close to the craft, JB said JP told him to "fire on it." Ed Cavanasac said when JB drew his weapon, he and JB went 'BLANK'.
From that moment,EC and JB had no recollection of events until the ending, which was when the craft(light) lifted up and took off. From the moment JB pulled his gun on the light(craft) he was suffering from amnesia.The missing time line became the middle (MEAT) of the event. See Sally Rayl's account dealing with J. Penniston.

very interesting. I could imagine that that is what actually happened. There's at least one other popular UFO incident involving Iranian jet fighters in which something similar occured. One of the pilots said that when he tried to launch a missile at the object his missile panel went out. The case is also on YT:



perhaps in JB's case not only his weapon but also his memory ''went out''. Btw, that's a very common issue in many alien abduction reports. ''Abductees'' only remember ''bits and pieces''.

On the dates and on the memo. It is clear that the wrong dates were put down and I fought that battle for years and was finally proven right after other documents came to life! There was also 3 nights to this not 2 and if you go to earth files you will see more witness are coming foreword to back this up! It is also clear a attempt was made to lump this in to one event and if you look at Larry Warren early testimony he had everything happening in one night starting with our incident and going into Halts incident.

considering the confusion about the date. Perhaps it was just one night ? I'm not sure but I think that LW said in some interview that he believed that Halt was out there investigating when he (Larry) had his experience. Why would ET ''take breaks'' ? On the other hand it would make sense that they came three times. If I wanted to make sure to receive some ''media attention'' - the way LW has described it (big cameras filming the event) - I would visit three times, too. First night: take ''whatever'' action on the base (e.g. shutting down nuclear weapons), 2nd night to make the base personnel think that they (ET) would perhaps return on a 3rd night. This way preparations like installing cameras and equipment could have been undertaken and the senior staff convoked and contact been made.

I never saw Jim examining the craft so I have no Idea how close I was. We split up briefly after what ever it was departed! Again I would have no Idea how long it took for Jim to examine the craft. And you need to go to earth files and Listen to Jim interview last summer! Silvertop can you post that. I was there when he got close to it! John

maybe you simply don't remember seeing Jim doing that. This sounds very much like a ''missing time'' experience induced by ET because you allegedly pointed a gun at the object.

In your letter home to your mother which you quote in LAEG, you wrote “At about three in the morning, a guy I know in D-Flight of Security Police told me he responded to a falling star outside the Weapons Storage Area".

funny enough that very poorly writen letter is very similar to col Halts memo! compair the two, its weird thenHalt does his memo on the 13th [...] i wrote the letter to my mom on 6 jan 81. [...] the similarity of my letter home, and Halts memo is frankly stunning, as i authored my letter a week before the col authored his. i was watering things down! i suspect Halt did the same with his memo!

considering C. Halt's rank I could imagine that he was part of the cover-up (I think he even said that himself). So he chose your ''poorly written'' letter for lack of an idea of what to say to the top senior staff. If he had been interrogated he could have referred to you. Thereby shifting responsibility to junior staff... just a thought.

[...] Then they said the thing appeared behind them – it seemed like it was playing games.

there are many other witness reports of pilots that also describe UFOs ''playing'' with them. I believe those were called ''foo fighters'' in former times.

The guys said that time seemed to them to be running slow, and in a different sensation than one experiences from an adrenalin induced temporal distortion. True?
Supposing for a moment that Jim and John were in the presence of such an exotic piece of kit, would it be that much of a stretch to expect some very strange side effects to come into play? For example, maybe the closer you get to it, the more intense the time distortion effect becomes.

In that case I would suspect some unhealthy side effects also. I mean, would'n that rip apart one's body if you were moving through different ''time zones'' ? You know, your leg is moving faster than your head etc.

[oOo]

Dunno Bro, maybe if you pull a Ministry of Funny Walks gait you might. As far as I know most peoples heads are above their legs. I wasn't writing chapter and verse for the Gospels, just something I thought of as I was typing. Trying to convey the idea that the fing in the forest had a sphere of influence.
Y'know, like the description of how the air seemed electrically charged. Maybe that field caused deep brain electromagnetic stimulation of the subthalamic nucleus resulting in a dissociative state.

Had the folks at Bentwaters heard of Jesse Marcel and Roswell before the RFI? Didn't he out Roswell a year or 2 before RFI became Britains Roswell? Would have been a very smart move for a bunch of young guys to establish their retirement fund whilst still in their early 20s.

I find the little detail about the weapons or lack of them interesting. Last thing you'd want when conducting an experiment is the subjects of the experiment getting nervous and shooting each other, or those running the experiment. I understand the protocols of why the weapons were left on base, but damn...how convenient.

According to John Burroughs, Jim Penniston thought JB was armed. JB said he did not carry a weapon. As they were getting close to the craft, JB said JP told him to "fire on it." Ed Cavanasac said when JB drew his weapon, he and JB went 'BLANK'.

Eh? Is that correct? How does a person draw a weapon he doesn't have?

Also find the presence of the geiger counter convenient. If I was told that the UFO is back, the first item I'd grab would be the camera. But then again I've never been stationed near a nuclear weapons depot.
Ahh thats right, I knew I had a reason for looking at the forum again....bunkers. Were there any underground facilities at the bases? I.E in case the poo hit the fan and the Soviets launched a strike on the bases. Nothing deep under the forest? Any underground facilities linking the two bases?
Well I'm off to bed to enjoy the by product of this website...freaky dreams. Very vivid, very hi-def TV quality dreams. The one with the greenish blue pearlescent ball of light buzzing an airbase whilst I was interviewing a chopper aircrew about a previous sighting was the best. Woke up thinking I'd seen something for real

[stephan]

Had the folks at Bentwaters heard of Jesse Marcel and Roswell before the RFI? Didn't he out Roswell a year or 2 before RFI became Britains Roswell? Would have been a very smart move for a bunch of young guys to establish their retirement fund whilst still in their early 20s.

I think that Roswell was (and is) well known among a handful of adepts of the military. That would perhaps explain for example the strange behavior of the guy who boarded the tower and never said a word to Sgt. Bobo. Probably he knew what was going on. Otherwise he might have asked some questions or so. And I guess it was LW who mentioned that during their ''interrogation'' by the OSI (or whomever) they were told that this UFO phenomena was older than themselves.

According to John Burroughs, Jim Penniston thought JB was armed. JB said he did not carry a weapon. As they were getting close to the craft, JB said JP told him to "fire on it." Ed Cavanasac said when JB drew his weapon, he and JB went 'BLANK'.

Eh? Is that correct? How does a person draw a weapon he doesn't have?

Maybe JB DID carry a weapon but he cannot remember it anymore. I won't be surprised if that was the case since he also has no recollection of Penniston examining the craft. Who knows what happened to their weapons during this ''missing time''.

Also find the presence of the geiger counter convenient. If I was told that the UFO is back, the first item I'd grab would be the camera. But then again I've never been stationed near a nuclear weapons depot.

according to LW that's what at least some of them did. They were allegedly filming the event with big movie cameras. I'd pay a lot to see this footage As for the geiger counter I have no idea either. Why should a UFO be radioactive ? There are three types of radioactivity: alpha rays (ionized helium), beta rays (electrons) and gamma rays (high energetic photons). The only type that would make sense here would be beta rays. If you look at the physiological effects and compare it with some of the statements made by some witnesses beta rays may have caused the Geigers to deflect:

skin irritation/ damage, cataract (eyes) and maybe this would even explain why J. Penniston thought the air and his skin were charged.

But allegedly others were exposed, too and it seems they were not (that much) affected. What I've always pondered about was that since J. Penniston and L. Warren were applied some dubious drugs during their interrogation those drugs could have caused their health problems afterwards.