Unknown witness

[redsocks]

I was looking at this website http://www.geocities.com/rafbentwaters/anew1.htm where an ex Bentwaters serviceman goes on to mention an SP who he knew back in the day was a witness to the UFO incident and even goes on to mention that he claimed to have touched the object,its an interesting read,check out the post by Bill Luebke under post 49 on the website mentioned.

Redsocks

[Observer]

Nice find redsocks
I wonder if that was Jim Penniston or one of the others guys out in the forest with him?
No body to my recollection has ever mentioned going inside the craft, and i thought the nearest any one got was JP just touching the out side. How the heck did he know it was ours from the future.
There is another old comrades [veterans] web site for those that served at the twin bases. I have lost it for the moment but in the big list of people read Chris Arnold's take on the incident. A totally different view point.

Obs

[redsocks]

Nice find redsocks
I wonder if that was Jim Penniston or one of the others guys out in the forest with him?
No body to my recollection has ever mentioned going inside the craft, and i thought the nearest any one got was JP just touching the out side. How the heck did he know it was ours from the future.
There is another old comrades [veterans] web site for those that served at the twin bases. I have lost it for the moment but in the big list of people read Chris Arnold's take on the incident. A totally different view point.

Obs

If this isnt Penniston or JB who is it?cos on the interviews I have seen only these two were there,did more turn up after the initial find after it was reported? can you enlighten us JB please.

Redsocks

[John Burroughs]

I will sure take a crack. I beleive he was talking about Penniston because that would be the time frame of him departing Bentwaters. I guess the other guy would be me because Halt has been saying over the years 1 or 2 people got on top of what ever it was on the first night. He just repeated it on the ABC special last month. I will try and get in touch with this guy because we both live in the same area and see what I came come up with. Redsocks just PM me saying he has information to show we were set up by the 67th AARS. He stated he didnot want to start a fight. Well I would love for him to produce what he has. Please have your Witness come on this site and present his proof for everybody to see and question just like I have. Redsocks I'm not some kind of cover for the government or am I trying to take anybody off cource on what they beleive. I can't speak for why Halt or Penniston and I would love to have them come on and tell what they know and why they have said what they have said. So please put out what you have and lets see what everybody thinks and if its true than maybe all of us can have some closure!!!

[redsocks]

I will sure take a crack. I beleive he was talking about Penniston because that would be the time frame of him departing Bentwaters. I guess the other guy would be me because Halt has been saying over the years 1 or 2 people got on top of what ever it was on the first night. He just repeated it on the ABC special last month. I will try and get in touch with this guy because we both live in the same area and see what I came come up with. Redsocks just PM me saying he has information to show we were set up by the 67th AARS. He stated he didnot want to start a fight. Well I would love for him to produce what he has. Please have your Witness come on this site and present his proof for everybody to see and question just like I have. Redsocks I'm not some kind of cover for the government or am I trying to take anybody off cource on what they beleive. I can't speak for why Halt or Penniston and I would love to have them come on and tell what they know and why they have said what they have said. So please put out what you have and lets see what everybody thinks and if its true than maybe all of us can have some closure!!!

Hi John
Like I said to you via PM I dont want to fall out here I would like to come up with an explanation that indeed would help you and let us all understand what happened to you that night as it must be driving you crazy.Myself and others have disected the facts on this website and gone down every avenue, believe me we PM with various theories constantly, check back we have gone through everthing but I and a few others keep coming up with the same fact which is the bases to the Rendlesham incident and thats the craft/object that you saw and may I say nobody disputes this all I have spoken to are sure you and Penniston saw something,for me that was noticeable seeing you interviewed on documentarys years back. To the craft Penniston mentions it sat on 3 legs(he took plastercastes of these indentations on the ground)he said it had the surface on an aircraft which brings us to the Apollo capsule used by 67th ARRS based at RAF woodbridge for seach and rescue,even Pennistons hastly drawn sketch looks like the capsule it even has the beacon light that fits in to the description and we know was dumped in and out of the woods by chopper.The Apollo capsule used by ARRS does fit Pennistons description and it did go missing for a while after the incident we know this but more inportantly and I refuse to mention the name of a member here who said this to me without their permission but will say what I was told and that is that a retired ARRS guy mentioned that there was talk of a big prank being played xmas 1980,now what prank we dont know but a big prank was said and they did have a capsule!Of the 3 airmen originally involved JB, Penniston and the other guy one of them must have know about the prank to set the others up.....Arrs dump the capsule SP radios other SP's who turn up and investigate and the rest is history.As for the second night the story of the UFO would have got about base and when Halt was informed "it has returned" simply took a team of guys to follow the lighthouse light fuelled by the hype of the previous nights sighting.
Now that might be brief but we have gone through everything to get here and I mean everything, it does make sense when you take all the accounts into fact.Over to you John you know how it works in the military with guys always playing pranks on each other,do you think John you and Jim Penniston could simply be the victim of a military prank and in time the facts have become a bit distorted.

Redsocks

[John Burroughs]

If all I saw was somthing on the ground ok. But how did it fly off at a high rate of speed what were the Blue lights flying around and beaming lights to the ground. How did they move it while we were there. I could beleive we or the Russian brought somthing down and there was a race to recover it. Or they were doing some kind of test IE EM Mind control but sorry it was not some kind of prank on us.

[Observer]

John

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but you have said several times that you only ever saw lights.

I believe you when you say this object took off at high speed. If it did then you must have seen an object/craft, or was it just lights that you saw take off at high speed?

There is one thing that can do that and its part of the ARRS equipment. Have a guess.

Obs

[John Burroughs]

There is nothing we have that caused what we saw take off. I know you and Redsock beleive in what your putting forword and thats great. But it was not the 67th playing a prank on us with a apollo spacecraft. Show me thats what it was not just put somthing down in writing. Go out and recreate it in the forrest or please bring forth the people who have given you this information and have me explain how they did it.

[Observer]

John

I could ask you to go out and re create a ELF or mind control test and produce the people who did it, but i won't.

It was a friend of mine who worked at Bentwaters who told me that he had heard that a huge practical joke was planned for the Christmas holidays and it was going to scare the 'shit' out of them. He did not tell me how it was going to be done because he did not know.

There is some thing that can accelerate an object upwards at high speed from the ground, Sky hook rescue.


Here is a another scenario, if you and a few other guys are in a dark woods at night because lights had been reported, in the middle of winter and you suddenly come across the nose/cockpit section of an F-117 Nighhawk sitting amongst the trees, there are flares lit up around it by a rescue team, you would all say what the F---k is that. It would look like an alien craft, because it was so secret even your Generals didn't know about it. It looked like nothing you had ever seen before. Some body has a peek in side and they see all the instrumentation written in English, my god, its ours from the future!! which in effect would be true.
John, all I'm doing is kicking around a few ideas.
Obs

[redsocks]

If all I saw was somthing on the ground ok. But how did it fly off at a high rate of speed what were the Blue lights flying around and beaming lights to the ground. How did they move it while we were there. I could beleive we or the Russian brought somthing down and there was a race to recover it. Or they were doing some kind of test IE EM Mind control but sorry it was not some kind of prank on us.

Hi John,

JB"If all I saw was something on the ground ok" so its possilble that it was the Apollo capsule are you saying that?
JB"but how did it fly off at a high rate of speed what where the blue lights flying around and beaming lights to the ground"
The object flying off seems to be a contencious issue,where are the 80 trained spotters to verify this?,that is a lot of people to see something so odd wouldnt you say.You have also said in the past John that all you saw was the craft not lights.
What do you suggest was brought down,we have checked out what sats on both sides were launched/ in orbit and they have all been accounted for,anything Russian would have been hit way out and if it was something brought down security would have been round the object testing it and they would not have taken it away without any ground support either way prank or something brought down sky hook could have pulled it up and they are pretty bloody quick and that includes the capsule.As for mind control etc I have read books on this and I cant see what intelligance they would recover with an experiment like that,most mind control experiments were done to see what affect they could have on the enemy on the battlefield(remember back in those days ground forces were still heavily used in war),I suppose mocking up a UFO in a war zone to stun the troops is possible but is I cant get my head round that one.
Like I said earlier John I dont want a fight here I am asking you the questions cos you are the key to this whole incident.

Redsocks

[redsocks]

Redsocks - Security Police doing 'Hot Knives' in the forest - come on !! that's almost libelous. It's the easiest thing to drug test for.

Tell me how you would prepair a hot knife in a forest please.

Nice googling though . .

Silvertop

It sounds like you are quoting me there which is not true,it was said by an ex USAF servicman on a "find buddies" site.
I will say though that the SP's were partying in the woods when this was supposed to have happened and do you really believe stuff like this doesent go on in the military?.enough said as I dont want to detract from the main topic here.

Redsocks

[John Burroughs]

Here is the problem. It didnot just stay on the ground. If we would have come up on somthing we would have reported it and secured it. What we came upon departed the area at a high rate of speed. On of the things I find funny is Ben has produce evidance that on Halts tape you can hear whats sounds like somthing IE a tree was knocked over yet nobody wants to follow up on that. There are several people who have talked about that and it in a couple of books. As far as recreating ELF I can't or mind control. But I have been given some inside information as take a look at this and see if it fits. The information points towards the Russians and guess what not all Sat are reported IE Top Secreat and there is allot of evidance out there showing the Russian were ahead of us in certain area to include plasma Balls ie Tesla and even Lazers. It appears they were able to jam cobra mist. Jenny Randles staes there were ships off the coast. Fishing ships are not allowed around the nest a and green haze is reported in the water. There a report of a local prison being evacuated vechicles stop working radio were interfeared with starnge balls of engery on the ground and in the air. Halt saying they appeared to be under some kind of phyiscal control. C-5 come in people go out in the forrest and the Weapons storage area. People being pulled off duty and sent home. Hastings report that a Air force officer says weapons are removed and taken state side. People in the WSA tower report seeing a large object over the forrest for several hours. Gen Gabriel comes to Bentawter after and take documents out. Williams fly the radio tapes to Germaney. By the way BTDT you said you were on duty Sat night was the 67th flying that night and if they were what was in the air. In fact was the airfiels open and operational and what was flying?

[John Burroughs]

One more thing Redsocks produce who was parting in the woods on the night of out incidents. Don't make a statement like that if you can't back it up. Give me the name of who said that and have them come on this forum. It was very cold those nights and I doubt anybody would be out partying in the woods when they could be inside somewhere. And before you respond with you struck a nerve guess what I can't stand it when people make a statement behind there computer that they can't back up. Stating that cops were out partying and not producing who and where is chicken S###. Were the cops supposed to be on duty off duty why were they in the forrest and where. Don't take a shot at the Security Police like that if you don't have the goods.

[John Burroughs]

Silver
I saw that piece, it was the Part Redsock said that the SP were partying in the woods when this was supposed to have happened. Which is a cheep shot and applies there was drinking and possibly drugs!!! Were you or were you not saying the guys on duty were partying and if you were show me the proof.

[John Burroughs]

Yes he did go back and look closer and now he is saying that he feels halt might have been under the influence in another post...

[redsocks]

Check out this link guys http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/photos ... 9&btnG.y=9
Click on the thunbnail pic bottom left,you can read that it is the actual capsule used by the 67th ARRS at Woodbridge.
Its on 3 legs and the surface is of aircraft appearance,both descriptions mentioned by Jim Penniston.

Redsocks

[redsocks]

Up goes the smoke screen this is exactly what happens here when people dont have answers to key questions.I am not taking a cheap shot at anyone,its crazy to suggest what you did John..read the posts "hot knife" was mentioned by an airman on another site he was there he saw it ask him,we all know what a "hot knife" is but it was not originally said by me please again read the post on that site.
do you need the link again??

Redsocks

[redsocks]

Hi Silvertop, Yeah the apollo sits on the stand I am not disputing that,if ARRS set this hoax up they would have sat it on its stand and not on the woodland floor,the whole gig would have been set up prior to contacting the SP's,it was pulled it up (I need to find what aircraft can pull the capsule ARRS must have had an aircraft to do this)and the stand collected later when the guys had gone. I bet there was a guys there waiting to retrieve the stand,youve got to remember the darkness in the woods would JB and JP really look for the stand,after all there were in a state of shock werent they,they proberly moved from its location pretty quickly I would wouldnt you?.

Redsocks

[redsocks]

Yes he did go back and look closer and now he is saying that he feels halt might have been under the influence in another post...

John this is kids stuff again read the post I stated that drink would have been at the xmas party.......We have looked into this long enough now John and theres enough evidence,come clean and get the closure you want,were you and JP simply the victim of an elaborate hoax?.

Redsocks

[John Burroughs]

Redsock You stated there would have been drink need I say more. That he went on a fun jant
your also implied the SP were partying in the forrest on the night of the incident. I will not stand by and have someone who has no Idea what there talking about and Hiding behind there Computer make those kind of statements about the Security Police on duty or a officer in the USAF. You got nothing have the people involved step forword! In your PM you stated there is going to be a book who is the arthur who are the sources wheres the proof. Months ago you tried to get me to come over behind the forum back and yes I still have the PM and I turned you down. And ever since you have been on a witch hunt. There is no smoke screen and numerous people have PM and E-mailed me to ignore you that your post are not worth my time. There right your not worth it!!!