The landing site [later general discussion]

[IanR]

Ian, ran into your pal down in glastonbury this past week, nice fella!

Which one?

Ian

[John Burroughs]

On the landing site. There were 3 nights ours started Thur night into Fri (Mids). Then Fri night into Sat Mids again I know that for sure because I went up to the base on Sat mourning the desk Sgt Obrain told me they had a incident he told me the Shift commander went out into the woods and was so upset she had to be releived of duty and sent home. That is why I went back on Sat night. I beleive after the 2 incidents that is why Halt was contacted. I dont beleive he was the first one contacted it would have been our commander Zigler who was at the Party. Halt has stated the shift commander showed up at the party and it was deceided he would go out and put it to rest. As far as the 2 sites go Penniston and him made that know on Sci fi but why not went they went out there together when Strange but true was filmed several years earlier!! When I got out there on Sat night there was lightalls in a clearing and Halt team was past where we first had our encounter. I know Halt knew where our site was because he went to the site that Friday mourning. I also know they were looking at a site on the tape before his encounter with the beams of light beaming at his feet and the lights braking into pieces by the farmers house which is if I remember right is where he stated his site was. Uncle Larry on Sat night were you working Swings or Mids when the incident happend?

[IanR]

As far as the 2 sites go Penniston and [Halt] made that know[n] on Sci fi [channel documentary] but why not [when] they went out there together when Strange but true was filmed several years earlier!!

Why not indeed! In fact, Halt seemed as surprised as anyone when Penniston identified this second site during the filming of the Sci fi channel programme. I don't think Halt and Penniston have seen eye to eye since then. Penniston was not with Halt when Halt came over late last year for the UFO Hunters programme.

Ian

[John Burroughs]

Could be Nevills seems to be the great Col new side kick!!

[IanR]

Could be Nevills seems to be the great Col new side kick!!

I think he is in the programme called Out of the Blue made by James (Jamie) Fox, but I haven't heard when or where that will be transmitted.

Ian

[John Burroughs]

From what I understand there working on a movie now. The out of the blue update is allready out.

[puddlepirate]

Sgt Obrain told me they had a incident he told me the Shift commander went out into the woods and was so upset she had to be releived of duty and sent home.

Was that the person being comforted in the forest when Lt Englund and his men arrived?

Given the apparent confusion over the precise location of the landing site - aren't we simply looking at three different sites, not one?

Three sites (apparently), scorch marks, area fenced off and guarded (secured by any other name) by USAF personnel and one person being comforted? That suggests something serious happened and for the airwoman to see something so upsetting that she had to be taken off duty and sent home indicates she might have seen bodies but not regular undamaged dead bodies but very badly wounded or mutilated bodies, or worse still, bits of bodies.

[Andy]

On the landing site. There were 3 nights ours started Thur night into Fri (Mids). Then Fri night into Sat Mids again I know that for sure because I went up to the base on Sat mourning the desk Sgt Obrain told me they had a incident he told me the Shift commander went out into the woods and was so upset she had to be releived of duty and sent home. That is why I went back on Sat night. I beleive after the 2 incidents that is why Halt was contacted. I dont beleive he was the first one contacted it would have been our commander Zigler who was at the Party. Halt has stated the shift commander showed up at the party and it was deceided he would go out and put it to rest. As far as the 2 sites go Penniston and him made that know on Sci fi but why not went they went out there together when Strange but true was filmed several years earlier!! When I got out there on Sat night there was lightalls in a clearing and Halt team was past where we first had our encounter. I know Halt knew where our site was because he went to the site that Friday mourning. I also know they were looking at a site on the tape before his encounter with the beams of light beaming at his feet and the lights braking into pieces by the farmers house which is if I remember right is where he stated his site was. Uncle Larry on Sat night were you working Swings or Mids when the incident happend?

That is really interesting. The second night was Halt's night?... correct me if i'm wrong. This is the first i've ever heard about a shift commander going out into the woods, but what did she see that was so disturbing that she had to take immediate sick leave?? According to Halt it was just some lights in the sky? It's a pity this woman has never gone on record.

Is also very interesting as you say, that Penniston suddenly changes his mind as to the alleged landing site, but never made this known in a previous documentary? Also that Halt was investigating another site, past your site, ?? yet apparently knew where your site was? Why would he want to do this? Makes no sense to me, whatsoever. However, in view of this i find Bustinza's account in 'You Can't Tell The People' interesting. I've always said Halt knows, and probably saw more than he is letting on.
Interesting also that in GB's book she shows the map and point 2. Landing site pointed out by Brenda Butler (and shown to her by Halt), and confirmed to Adrian Bustinza.

I've no doubt he's a very nice man, but i'm afraid i have to say, in view of things, Halt has made himself look an idiot over the years, (and he is not the only one as there are seemingly many more), and people aren't stupid.

[Andy]

John Burroughs might be able to confirm if the Halt team were investigating the same site that he and Jim Penniston had witnessed, or whether this was a landing site witnessed/found by somebody else?

If Halt wasn't investigating the 'real' site, then so much of what this case is based on - the radiation readings, the landing marks and the tree damage - is rendered meaningless. This is what I meant in an earlier post about the cover-up theorists throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

How Nick P and Georgina B squared their opposing beliefs on this I have never fathomed. Nick P has always espoused the radiation readings and the landing marks at the Halt site as the strongest evidence in favour of something unusual, while Georgina was dismissive of Halt and supported Penniston's entirely different landing site (as Andy has remarked in a previous post).

So if the two strongest proponents of this case cannot agree on a basic issue such as this, who needs an official cover-up? Or are Georgina and the Pope really the disinformation agents??

Ian

I've often wondered that too Ian. I'm not speaking ill of the dead here, but she was another one when i emailed her with a simple question who could not give me a straight answer. As said, some really don't do themselves any favours, or their credibility.

[John Burroughs]

Sgt Obrian was the Desk Sgt and was typing up the report and the blooter entry on the incident. she did not see dead bodies but was freaked out by the beams of light that lit up her vehicle and the blue lights that and i quate the report that passed threw her vehicle and caused her vehicle to shut down. They also lost radio contact with her for over 10 min.... Andy less get this straight I thought I made myself very clear in my last post. Halt was out there on the third night not the second.....

[John Burroughs]

Halt saw somthing land which is why there are 2 sights. Remember Bustina was not out there with me on the first night but was with Halt and me on the third night. I was told by Halt when I ment up with them that somthing landed the third night and by Bustina also. The problem I have with Penniston and Halt is they had to know from the begining there were 2 different sites. Halt even talks about the plaster cast Penniston took so he knew where are site was. It looks like Halt is trying to confused the 2 sites and what was seen just like his memo did with the dates

[Andy]

Sgt Obrian was the Desk Sgt and was typing up the report and the blooter entry on the incident. she did not see dead bodies but was freaked out by the beams of light that lit up her vehicle and the blue lights that and i quate the report that passed threw her vehicle and caused her vehicle to shut down. They also lost radio contact with her for over 10 min.... Andy less get this straight I thought I made myself very clear in my last post. Halt was out there on the third night not the second.....

So the woman was freaked out by blue lighthouse beams? Not being facetious here.

John, no disrespect, but don't ever say to me 'I thought i made myself very clear' and that goes for others, because we wouldn't be having this discussion now.

To my understanding, and the claim that Halt was out there on the third night, (and not the second, which i understood to be his night).... and to my understanding was also Larry Warren's claimed night? (ie the third), would suggest to me that LW and AB accounts fit a site more accurate than others i have read? But then, on the scale of things, their rank was nowhere near that of a colonel, leutenant etc, and therefore lower down in the re-cycling waste disposal system.

[Andy]

Halt saw somthing land which is why there are 2 sights. Remember Bustina was not out there with me on the first night but was with Halt and me on the third night. I was told by Halt when I ment up with them that somthing landed the third night and by Bustina also. The problem I have with Penniston and Halt is they had to know from the begining there were 2 different sites. Halt even talks about the plaster cast Penniston took so he knew where are site was. It looks like Halt is trying to confused the 2 sites and what was seen just like his memo did with the dates

So where did Halt see something land? According to him, all he saw were lights above the ground and sending down beams?

[Andy]

Sgt Obrian was the Desk Sgt and was typing up the report and the blooter entry on the incident. she did not see dead bodies but was freaked out by the beams of light that lit up her vehicle and the blue lights that and i quate the report that passed threw her vehicle and caused her vehicle to shut down. They also lost radio contact with her for over 10 min.... Andy less get this straight I thought I made myself very clear in my last post. Halt was out there on the third night not the second.....

This does fascinate me though, ie vehicles shutting down, radios mal-functioning etc, because i know for a fact, where you were is the area where on many occasions my dogs have re-acted out of character, compasses have gone hay-wire, and mobile (cell) phones have mysteriously malfunctioned? Yet other times, everything is normal? I have no answers, but would like to know what is going on? It is very bizarre, and you really have to witness it to believe it.

[Andy]

John Burroughs might be able to confirm if the Halt team were investigating the same site that he and Jim Penniston had witnessed, or whether this was a landing site witnessed/found by somebody else?

If Halt wasn't investigating the 'real' site, then so much of what this case is based on - the radiation readings, the landing marks and the tree damage - is rendered meaningless. This is what I meant in an earlier post about the cover-up theorists throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

How Nick P and Georgina B squared their opposing beliefs on this I have never fathomed. Nick P has always espoused the radiation readings and the landing marks at the Halt site as the strongest evidence in favour of something unusual, while Georgina was dismissive of Halt and supported Penniston's entirely different landing site (as Andy has remarked in a previous post).

So if the two strongest proponents of this case cannot agree on a basic issue such as this, who needs an official cover-up? Or are Georgina and the Pope really the disinformation agents??

Ian

But then Ian, she has never supported Penniston's landing site, on the face of it..... because he has never been up front and lucid as to where exactly his alleged landing site was/is? I know she reckons he is a 'reliable witness' but to be quite honest from what i've read about him, and his accounts there has been no apparent consistency? So why should i believe this man either?

[John Burroughs]

Andy
First of all no disrespect taken but I did make it clear in my post which you posted with your question which night was which. I also did not say light house beams but beams of Light which came from the sky not a lighthouse. It has taken me so many years to show the dates were wrong in Halts memo plus that there was three nights. As far as Halt goes I stated that is what he told me when we ment up on the third night. He never said what landed just somthing landed he then pointed up in the sky and showed me the Blue lights that were flying around. As we watched them thats when we saw one of them beam lights inside the storage area and the radio trafffic went nuts. After that somthing then appeared in the distance which is what Bustina and I went after. Georgni Bruni did allot of hard work and came up with allot of information with the help of Lord Hill Norton. As far as Nick Pope goes what has he ever really stated other than what is allready know. People go to him because of his Title he has never as far as i know stated anything that was earth shattering has he?

[Andy]

Andy
First of all no disrespect taken but I did make it clear in my post which you posted with your question which night was which. I also did not say light house beams but beams of Light which came from the sky not a lighthouse. It has taken me so many years to show the dates were wrong in Halts memo plus that there was three nights. As far as Halt goes I stated that is what he told me when we ment up on the third night. He never said what landed just somthing landed he then pointed up in the sky and showed me the Blue lights that were flying around. As we watched them thats when we saw one of them beam lights inside the storage area and the radio trafffic went nuts. After that somthing then appeared in the distance which is what Bustina and I went after. Georgni Bruni did allot of hard work and came up with allot of information with the help of Lord Hill Norton. As far as Nick Pope goes what has he ever really stated other than what is allready know. People go to him because of his Title he has never as far as i know stated anything that was earth shattering has he?

Don't get me started on Nick Pope I value my membership of this forum too much The least i say on this matter the better, me thinks

[AdrianF]

John,

You went back for the "Strange But True" filming right? Did you get a chance to go back to the forest to have a scout around and find the ball park area of where you think your encounter was?
I appreciate that memory fades a bit and the forest has completely changed, but do you think you could still find that ball park location?

Cheers
Adrian

[Andy]

As said, i keep a very open mind on this case, and just seek an answer, no matter how mundane it might turn out to be. However, and no b**l S**t this one always sticks in my mind.

There is a colleague of mine who i have known for the past twenty odd years. A lovely woman, and as honest as the day is long. Back at the time of the alleged incidents she was dating a forestry worker (as it turned out, i trained alongside his sister, another psychiatric nurse and a no nonsense type, so if he was like his sister, i would have no reason to disbelieve him either). Apparently this guy was visited by 'The men in black' type and forced to sign a document in the days after, due to what he had apparently seen. He tried to explain to my colleague, but she became fearful and asked him to not say anything more, as she was very freaked out and scared by it all. In the long run this man had a mental 'breakdown' due to what he had apparently seen ie a saucer in the forest. I kid you not, and may i be struck down dead. This was exactly as it was relayed to me, and as said, if i didn't know the person who relayed it to me, i would say she was a fantasist, but she is definitely not. I can't speak for the guy who relayed the information to her, but as said i know his sister, and apples don't generally fall far from trees.

[Andrew Pike]

Hi Larry!!

As I said down in Glastonbury I'll finally register on this site after years of looking as a guest!! So here I am another astronomer sticking his nose into Rendlesham!!!

I'm not sure I can go as far as saying I'm a pal of Ian's more of another astronomer interested in Rendlesham, although I know of Ian and his work in astronomy and I did reassured Larry Ian is a nice guy really.

Anyway It was great to catch up with you Larry and I liked your talk on Sunday night.

On Wednesday I also spent the day with Captain Ray Bowyer (the one who saw two mile wide UFOs over Guernsey last year) while filming for Glastonbury Radio's new TV show (the clip you filmed to slot in came out OK as did Nick Pope's!). Ray was telling me about when he met up with Halt and Penniston and how he actually held Penniston's note book with the symbols and drawings. He seemed very impressed with the Rendlesham case.

Anyway just thought I'd let you know I'm here as promised!!