Moderator Comments - OVER AND OUT.

[John Burroughs]

John, what was that freight train coming you were on about ?

I never said the freight train was going to be all positive or negative did I? What I do know is I showed up and was willing to answer any question and face the music which I did!

So, what was the freight train, and do you consider it positive or negative ?

You never have been a lost for words before now arvd???

[John Burroughs]

Hey John (Burroughs),

I am new to this board. I have been aware of this incident since "Strange But True" was shown in the UK and "Unsolved Mysteries" in the 90s but have only recently looked at in more detail. I have heard you speak on podcasts and radio shows as well as TV shows that are now on Youtube. To me you always seem to be the most balanced and credible witness to the incident. The Skeptics seem to be unable to open minded enough to accept anything other than their own little theory and so carry on with the Lighthouse, manure truck, Apollo capsule or whatever it may be. In fact none of their theories really stand up as the lighthouse never caused any trouble before or after did it?

I have always thought you wanted to know what really went on over those couple of nights back in December 1980 and still do. But could you answer the following questions?

And I apologise if you have done before (as I said I am brand new to the forum)

[*]What are your views on the ever expanding details coming from Jim Penniston on the story (especially the binary codes)?

[*]Do you think Colonel Halt knows more about the incident than he has revealed?

[*]Why the sudden outburst of Einstein quotes?

Thanks in advance Ed

Like I said before the codes were a shock to me when I found out about them in OCT! I do know this on the Sunday night after the incidents when I went over to Jim house to tell him about what happened when I was out with Halt Jim did say he was having problems with something he was feeling but said nothing about any codes! I know under Jim Hypnosis in the 90's something did come out about binary codes. As far as Jim expanding details I'm listening just like everybody else is.
Yes I believe COL Halt knows more than he is saying! Always have always will! On Einstein when I first tried to talk about what I knew and felt in DEC it sure did look like nobody wanted to listen! So I sat back and watched the show! During that time frame several people contacted me and said why was I allowing this to happen does that mean its all true. I also was accused of when I first responded I was being defensive. You tell me do the quotes I have used not fit what was said? Plus I wanted to let everybody say what they had to say before I responded. Didn't want to be accused of shutting somebody down like I have before! This forum has been going on for years there are several people who like it because they love to debate! The wheels on the bus go round and round round and round. They love to take pot shots at me and others! They claim they have inside information. They then claim there sick of what is being said and are finished with the incident never to return! But they always come back why???

[Open Mind Ed]

Hey John (Burroughs),

I am new to this board. I have been aware of this incident since "Strange But True" was shown in the UK and "Unsolved Mysteries" in the 90s but have only recently looked at in more detail. I have heard you speak on podcasts and radio shows as well as TV shows that are now on Youtube. To me you always seem to be the most balanced and credible witness to the incident. The Skeptics seem to be unable to open minded enough to accept anything other than their own little theory and so carry on with the Lighthouse, manure truck, Apollo capsule or whatever it may be. In fact none of their theories really stand up as the lighthouse never caused any trouble before or after did it?

I have always thought you wanted to know what really went on over those couple of nights back in December 1980 and still do. But could you answer the following questions?

And I apologise if you have done before (as I said I am brand new to the forum)

[*]What are your views on the ever expanding details coming from Jim Penniston on the story (especially the binary codes)?

[*]Do you think Colonel Halt knows more about the incident than he has revealed?

[*]Why the sudden outburst of Einstein quotes?

Thanks in advance Ed

Like I said before the codes were a shock to me when I found out about them in OCT! I do know this on the Sunday night after the incidents when I went over to Jim house to tell him about what happened when I was out with Halt Jim did say he was having problems with something he was feeling but said nothing about any codes! I know under Jim Hypnosis in the 90's something did come out about binary codes. As far as Jim expanding details I'm listening just like everybody else is.
Yes I believe COL Halt Knows more than he is saying! On Einstein when I first tried to talk about what I knew and felt in DEC it sure did look like nobody wanted to listen! So I sat back and watched the show! During that time frame several people contacted me and said why was I allowing this to happen does that mean its all true. I also was accused of when I first responded I was being defensive. You tell me do the quotes I have used not fit what was said? Plus I wanted to let everybody say what they had to say before I responded. Didn't want to be accused of shutting somebody down like I have before!!!

Thanks John. As I said I am still studying all of this very strange stuff. You were actually out there when it happened and I think a lot of people do listen to your point of view (like myself - but simply never feedback via a forum like this). A lot of people just lurk on here without speaking out. The Einstein quotes are "interesting" and I do get your point. I guess you get sick of defending your point of view as well to some less open minded people. As I said you seem to be the most credible witness to have gone public with all of this and I hope that one day we truly find out what went on over that holiday period in Rendlesham 1980. My fear is that we won't and this will end up shrouded in myth like Roswell.

[John Burroughs]

Hey John (Burroughs),

I am new to this board. I have been aware of this incident since "Strange But True" was shown in the UK and "Unsolved Mysteries" in the 90s but have only recently looked at in more detail. I have heard you speak on podcasts and radio shows as well as TV shows that are now on Youtube. To me you always seem to be the most balanced and credible witness to the incident. The Skeptics seem to be unable to open minded enough to accept anything other than their own little theory and so carry on with the Lighthouse, manure truck, Apollo capsule or whatever it may be. In fact none of their theories really stand up as the lighthouse never caused any trouble before or after did it?

I have always thought you wanted to know what really went on over those couple of nights back in December 1980 and still do. But could you answer the following questions?

And I apologise if you have done before (as I said I am brand new to the forum)

[*]What are your views on the ever expanding details coming from Jim Penniston on the story (especially the binary codes)?

[*]Do you think Colonel Halt knows more about the incident than he has revealed?

[*]Why the sudden outburst of Einstein quotes?

Thanks in advance Ed

Like I said before the codes were a shock to me when I found out about them in OCT! I do know this on the Sunday night after the incidents when I went over to Jim house to tell him about what happened when I was out with Halt Jim did say he was having problems with something he was feeling but said nothing about any codes! I know under Jim Hypnosis in the 90's something did come out about binary codes. As far as Jim expanding details I'm listening just like everybody else is.
Yes I believe COL Halt Knows more than he is saying! On Einstein when I first tried to talk about what I knew and felt in DEC it sure did look like nobody wanted to listen! So I sat back and watched the show! During that time frame several people contacted me and said why was I allowing this to happen does that mean its all true. I also was accused of when I first responded I was being defensive. You tell me do the quotes I have used not fit what was said? Plus I wanted to let everybody say what they had to say before I responded. Didn't want to be accused of shutting somebody down like I have before!!!

Thanks John. As I said I am still studying all of this very strange stuff. You were actually out there when it happened and I think a lot of people do listen to your point of view (like myself - but simply never feedback via a forum like this). A lot of people just lurk on here without speaking out. The Einstein quotes are "interesting" and I do get your point. I guess you get sick of defending your point of view as well to some less open minded people. As I said you seem to be the most credible witness to have gone public with all of this and I hope that one day we truly find out what went on over that holiday period in Rendlesham 1980. My fear is that we won't and this will end up shrouded in myth like Roswell.

All that is valuable in human society depends upon the opportunity for development accorded the individual.
Albert Einstein

All these primary impulses, not easily described in words, are the springs of man's actions.
Albert Einstein

To me I have been open on what I remember! I have also talked about about what came out under Hypnosis! I may never find out the whole truth but I will keep trying! The one thing I do feel that we were exposed to some kind of EM field not sure from where but that's what I feel! "Opinions are like assholes. Everybody's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks." But at the end of the day I was there and have to live with it don't I!!!

[John Burroughs]

John I enjoyed alot of the conference and have never critcised the organisers. The only things that ruined the conference were the binary code and the backstabbing of Col. Halt. I am angry because this has made a mockery of the RFI. Before that I was willing to take your statements at face value. But now the binary code has been proved to be fake I can't help but look at everything in a more skeptical manner. In one foul swoop this self serving binary bs story has damaged the credibility of all the witnesses to a degree. Theres never has been much physical evidence to support the RFI, but what made this case special was that the witnesses were security police, who were supposedly reliable highly trained observers that you could TRUST. But unfortunately this assumption has now been proved wrong.

I don't believe I said anything different about Halt than I have said before! I don't feel is telling the truth about all he knows! I also was aware of the UNX-X team I was contacted about doing that and declined. Have you viewed those pro-mos? As far as the codes go that came from one man not everybody who was out there! When I was doing the piece for the History channel in OCT Jim had his notebook and he showed it to me. That's where codes came up! Now what I'm about to say is how it went down in front of my eyes! I had no Idea he had written down the codes! I was informed the History channel was going to look at them! Jim did say he felt nothing would come out of them! They took 5 pages and ran them! Before the codes came up they were going to do a 1 hr piece on the incident. They had interviewed Halt Pope and others. They even went over and filmed the Forrest when they interviewed Pope and others! Then follow up with a 2 hour special on us going over for the 30th anniversary! After they saw the zero and ones they took them to there so called experts and came up with High Brazil and ran with the show they did. They changed the whole show on there own. They failed to show that without a decimal point there were loads of possibilities. There are 24 points I believe just off the first 5 pages alone! As far as I know Jim or they have said he sold those 5 pages to them. Ask them if he did! I was told the day before I got on the airplane that they had changed the whole show! Linda by then had taken the 5 pages and had them looked at by 2 other people who came up with different locations and opinions. So what do you make out of all of this? History says there sticking with High Brazil and are checking that area out! What if they come up with something then what? What if something turns up at one of these other points! Not saying it will but what if it does? Why don't you ask Jim why the points come up the way they do? Why don't you have somebody who is a expert take all the points and the explanation Silver Top has put out and brake it down. If your saying Jim did this why don't you have then show how he did it. Just saying he used Goggle earth does not account for all the time it would have taken to do it and the way he did it! The codes being released are just one small piece of what has come out nothing else! And they came from one man nobody else. I do believe this if Jim wanted to make a bigger up roar good or bad to hurt this case he would have released them at the National Press Club and talked about them on Larry King live. There is to many questions and not enough answers to pass judgment on Jim or anybody Else's involved in this incident! Why don't you start by asking Jim about the the goggle theory. Why don't you ask him when will he have the notebook tested? Ask him why doesn't he have the codes looked at by a major university! Those are the questions I would be asking! Everybody is jumping up and down about this but nobody that I know of has asked Jim this directly! The justice page or Bentwaters 1980 is there but instead of attacking him why don't you brake it down and ask for his response! Also why don't you contact the History Channel and ask them for there response and see if there willing to have there results looked at by a major university!

[John Burroughs]

If I was him I'd get off that train while I had a bit of credibility left and jump on the Halt bandwagon

Out of the frying pan...

"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds." Albert Einstein

[Ignis Fatuus]

John
The one thing I do feel that we were exposed to some kind of EM field not sure from where but that's what I feel!

And on your return visit? Any buzzy sensations? Solving the farmhouse on fire effect felt pretty cool eh.

[John Burroughs]

Ignis Fatuus
John "The one thing I do feel that we were exposed to some kind of EM field not sure from where but that's what I feel!"
Ignis And on your return visit? Any buzzy sensations? Solving the farmhouse on fire effect felt pretty cool eh.

Lets see that the Ignis I expected. You ask a question and you receive a answer. He has all of the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire.
Winston Churchill

I always avoid prophesying beforehand, because it is a much better policy to prophesy after the event has already taken place.
Winston Churchill

[Ignis Fatuus]

[John Burroughs]

We're off to see the Wizard, The Wonderful Wizard of Oz.
You'll find he is a whiz of a Wiz! If ever a Wiz! there was.
If ever oh ever a Wiz! there was The Wizard of Oz is one because,
Because, because, because, because, because.
Because of the wonderful things he does.
We're off to see the Wizard. The Wonderful Wizard of Oz

Follow the Yellow Brick Road. Follow the Yellow Brick Road.
Follow, follow, follow, follow,
Follow the Yellow Brick Road.
Follow the Yellow Brick, Follow the Yellow Brick,
Follow the Yellow Brick Road.

[John Burroughs]

Napoleon complex is an informal term describing an alleged type of inferiority complex which is said to affect some people, especially men, who are short in stature. The term is also used more generally to describe people who are driven by a perceived handicap to overcompensate in other aspects of their lives. Other names for the term include Napoleon syndrom!!

[John Burroughs]

Napoleon complex is an informal term describing an alleged type of inferiority complex which is said to affect some people, especially men, who are short in stature. The term is also used more generally to describe people who are driven by a perceived handicap to overcompensate in other aspects of their lives. Other names for the term include Napoleon syndrom!!

I have taken more out of alcohol than alcohol has taken out of me.
Winston Churchill

[Ignis Fatuus]

Napoleon complex is an informal term describing an alleged type of inferiority complex which is said to affect some people, especially men, who are short in stature. The term is also used more generally to describe people who are driven by a perceived handicap to overcompensate in other aspects of their lives. Other names for the term include Napoleon syndrom!!

Well that's Goliath's excuse everytime.

You'd be better off directing your anger towards your own crew - you had a fast one pulled on you. You always were better as a solo artist.

I have taken more out of alcohol than alcohol has taken out of me.
Winston Churchill

You deserve that drink more than most Mr Churchill..well played sir.

[Daniel]

1. The binary code coordinates were taken from google earth. (Silvertop)

2. A similar binary code story featured on the X-Files. (Ignis Fatuus)

3. The guy who decoded the binary for the History Channel stated that the most likely source of the code was his own online encoding software (this part was edited out by the History Channel) (Isaac)

These three statements don't really mean much. The Coordinates could have come from Google Earth if we match the subjective locations with the decode binary sequence. Earthfiles changed the W in the message to E just to get the Woodbridge Town Centre. There are no period points in the sequence, so we have no real idea where they point to, only where we believe they point to.

The X-File episode was pretty good, but they may have gathered their ideas from real life stories. Dean Haglund (Actor) has made the claim that Chris Carter had been approached by the FBI and NASA with story ideas.

The third statement is absolutely false. Converting Binary to decimal and Hexidecimal, in your head, is fairly easy to do. No software is necessarily required to make the conversion. I must admit I still need the ASCII Chart to interpret what the decimal results are.

[AdrianF]

It's funny you should mention alcohol John. I came in late last night and read through your posts, but I'd had quite a bit to drink, so I refrained from posting. I came back this morning thinking I was going to make a few well reasoned responses, but reading a little more whilst sober, what's the fucking point. Over and out.

[Daniel]

The chances of the binary matching the Woodbridge coordinates are infentesimal. Also the East/West error is a very common human error (especially if you live in the US) which just points even more towards a human source for the message.

Can't see why you would still choose West over East even when you're living in the USA. But there is always the possibility of human error as the W and E are both next to each other on the keyboard. We then have these coordinates where the 8100 isn't included even though it comes before the 520942532N... we seem to assume it isn't part of it. It feels the decoders are subjectively thinking to get their own result.

Maybe X-Files did get it from another source- But unless we see another genuine UFO report with binary this will be in doubt.

I do remember reading another binary coded story in the past, but can't seem to locate it.

Pity the History Channel didn't ask you to decode it as it sounds like you're better qualified than Nick Ciske-

Typical childish BS remark cheers.

Isaac : (4) Could one of the online tools relating to binary code (including one that you appear to have developed) have been used in reverse to translate the relevant "possible message" into the binary code?

Nick Ciske :4. Yes, that's exactly what my tool does, and the most plausible explanation for how the message was generated. [Isaac - This view was not shown in the documentary. Indeed, Nick's comments as shown in the documentary implied that it would be difficult for somone to generate the relevant text. Nick is shown as saying "Could someone write out 6 pages of binary? Well, probably not. They would need some help or they would have to be some sort of savant or super calculator."]

RendleSham (Unless they were just copying it down from a computor program of course)

You see you didn't quote this in your previous message. It may have been more understandable than making the reader believe Nick's software is the only tool that could have been used. I don't agree with idea that it would be hard for someone to generate 6 pages of text unless they're some sort of super calculator. Just get an ASCII chart, get the decimal values for the letter and then convert the decimal value into binary. Of course this could take some time to do but we're talking hours here.

What we need is someone with handwriting examining experience to see what they get from Jims written sequence. In my opinion if Jim wrote it down from a computer programme he would have set it out in 8-bit blocks to make it easier to read. Pause every so often to see the next sequence to write down, creating possibly a neatly drawn 0 or 1. Would have been accurate in writing down the information.

Of course Jim may have wanted people to believe he did it on a spur of the moment, but to do that he would probably have to record it to audio first and then write it down.

99% of me says this sequence is rubbish but the other 1% of me has to ask questions.

[John Burroughs]

It's funny you should mention alcohol John. I came in late last night and read through your posts, but I'd had quite a bit to drink, so I refrained from posting. I came back this morning thinking I was going to make a few well reasoned responses, but reading a little more whilst sober, what's the fucking point. Over and out.

If you're going through hell, keep going.
Winston Churchill

[John Burroughs]

Napoleon complex is an informal term describing an alleged type of inferiority complex which is said to affect some people, especially men, who are short in stature. The term is also used more generally to describe people who are driven by a perceived handicap to overcompensate in other aspects of their lives. Other names for the term include Napoleon syndrom!!

Well that's Goliath's excuse everytime.

You'd be better off directing your anger towards your own crew - you had a fast one pulled on you. You always were better as a solo artist.It is a fine thing to be honest, but it is also very important to be right.
Winston Churchill

I have taken more out of alcohol than alcohol has taken out of me.
Winston Churchill

You deserve that drink more than most Mr Churchill..well played sir.

It is more agreeable to have the power to give than to receive.
Winston Churchill

[marantz]

HEY Burroughs. Remember Lt Englund AND Lt Tamplin who had the accident in the C-J7 returning from Woodbridge night after you saw aliens? TRIED to avoid hitting a deer.

DO you remember the LOST GAU incident? WHOLE Squadron was questioned and it turned out an Airmen was invited into the Armory to visit graveyard Armorer and stuffed the GAU in his Alert bag. LATER was told he had thrown it into the River Orwell when things started to heat up.

[John Burroughs]

HEY Burroughs. Remember Lt Englund AND Lt Tamplin who had the accident in the C-J7 returning from Woodbridge night after you saw aliens? TRIED to avoid hitting a deer. Well the problem with that is Lt Buren was on duty the first night! And on Halts night Englund was out there with Ball Lt Tamlin was not on duty. So which night were those two together?

DO you remember the LOST GAU incident? WHOLE Squadron was questioned and it turned out an Airmen was invited into the Armory to visit graveyard Armorer and stuffed the GAU in his Alert bag. LATER was told he had thrown it into the River Orwell when things started to heat up.

Yes I remember that!

New meat guys fire away! Of course I have no Idea who he is as usual I don't see a full name!